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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Feb 22, 2017 15:55:06 GMT -6
Inside info that the Rockies are planning to spend big on IFA next year? Lol
I agree the discussion is good. That's how changes get made. Have to discuss it to try and build consensus.
My original thought is in agreement with CWS in that these are the only players we just freely give to a team.
But I don't support adding them to the draft myself. These players carry more risk and we may get some bad teams taking bigger risks in the draft.
I think a points system is super simple. I'd even volunteer to manage it. 50 points for 5 years. Teams can use their points however they want over those seasons. Spend big one year and you'll pay for it the next 4. Very similar to the sanctions that happen IRL. Minimum bid is 5 points so that will limit the number of players that are even involved. Highest bid for 24 hours and the guy is yours. Create a deadline whereby no new players can be bid on and just let the current players being bid on finish out. I really think this is simple. Very realistic. Gives everyone a shot and doesn't tie teams down financially. Plus eliminates the bias that occurs by owning a real life big spender. Again, I'd volunteer to track it I think it's so simple.
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Post by PadresGM on Feb 22, 2017 20:41:48 GMT -6
I wasn't making a suggestion, just stating an idea that I had. As for the point system, that could be interesting, but it's a little complex and I feel it may not help with parity, but rather make the rich richer. If we were to do anything, I would like to add the IRA's to the FYPD, but I think the system is fine and cyclical where some teams will have a big year, and the next year will be another team's big yeat
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2017 18:57:17 GMT -6
My only thoughts on things like a points system are things like that could work out great IF we knew teams were in this long term. So many of these teams here get abandoned which makes for quite of a mess to clean up. So many teams go with a "win now" strategy and as soon as it doesn't work, they bail out. We were left last year with an unowned Giants team that had no open slots to resign Bumgarner which tremendously hurt that team. I guess my take would be if we're seeing some teams not keeping up with some of our simpler things now, it may not be a good time to add to it. If we do ever seem to become completely stable and it does seem like people will stay through the good and bad years, that's when I'd think we could open things up a bit if wanted.
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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Nov 17, 2017 12:31:19 GMT -6
Bringing this up again.
So it sounds like the real life Braves were cheaters and will likely lose several of their international signings-including last years number 1 overall prospect Kevin Maitan. So he will be a free agent again the next IFA period. So who owns him? Obviously it's a disaster to say anyone other than the Braves. I mean he could've traded guys already, etc.. but it also doesn't seem right that because a real life team cheated the Braves in our league get a top prospect.
Then I also can bring up Shohei Otani. How is it fair that some team gets an instant MLB starter at just age 23 just because their real life team signs him. Would be MUCH funner for us all to get to bid for him.
So I propose we change the IFA system.
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 13:33:37 GMT -6
Bringing this up again. So it sounds like the real life Braves were cheaters and will likely lose several of their international signings-including last years number 1 overall prospect Kevin Maitan. So he will be a free agent again the next IFA period. So who owns him? Obviously it's a disaster to say anyone other than the Braves. I mean he could've traded guys already, etc.. but it also doesn't seem right that because a real life team cheated the Braves in our league get a top prospect. Then I also can bring up Shohei Otani. How is it fair that some team gets an instant MLB starter at just age 23 just because their real life team signs him. Would be MUCH funner for us all to get to bid for him. So I propose we change the IFA system. I don't see that happening with IFA no system will ever be perfect someone will always have a grip. Pretty sure we have tried a few rules here in regards to IFA or made this one based on how rules played out in other leagues. As for the these prospects we will have to discuss esp since they may have already played in Braves system even some could have been traded.
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 13:37:53 GMT -6
Bringing this up again. So it sounds like the real life Braves were cheaters and will likely lose several of their international signings-including last years number 1 overall prospect Kevin Maitan. So he will be a free agent again the next IFA period. So who owns him? Obviously it's a disaster to say anyone other than the Braves. I mean he could've traded guys already, etc.. but it also doesn't seem right that because a real life team cheated the Braves in our league get a top prospect. Then I also can bring up Shohei Otani. How is it fair that some team gets an instant MLB starter at just age 23 just because their real life team signs him. Would be MUCH funner for us all to get to bid for him. So I propose we change the IFA system. I don't see that happening with IFA no system will ever be perfect someone will always have a grip. Pretty sure we have tried a few rules here in regards to IFA or made this one based on how rules played out in other leagues. As for the these prospects we will have to discuss esp since they may have already played in Braves system even some could have been traded. Also pretty sure Otani will be a ML contract thus a free agent here.
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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Nov 17, 2017 15:01:04 GMT -6
Saw it reported Otani will be a minor league contract and then immediately promoted to MLB contract. But he will go against someone's IFA pool. Could be a cheap way for someone to add an elite player.
I still don't get why we can't just bid on IFAs. Just the top 10 or something. Just add the top 10 IFAs by an agreed upon source to the FA pool. Would solve the issue for the elite players people care about.
IFAs are so important to MLB I hate seeing teams get those guys for free. If we bid on the top 10 guys it would be a similar approach as the draft where we draft the top rounds and the rest go with their real team.
We should probably also discuss a contingency for real life IFAs that are taken from s team for rules violations.
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 15:05:26 GMT -6
Saw it reported Otani will be a minor league contract and then immediately promoted to MLB contract. But he will go against someone's IFA pool. Could be a cheap way for someone to add an elite player. I still don't get why we can't just bid on IFAs. Just the top 10 or something. Just add the top 10 IFAs by an agreed upon source to the FA pool. Would solve the issue for the elite players people care about. IFAs are so important to MLB I hate seeing teams get those guys for free. If we bid on the top 10 guys it would be a similar approach as the draft where we draft the top rounds and the rest go with their real team. We should probably also discuss a contingency for real life IFAs that are taken from s team for rules violations. Not sure where you read that since no one has any idea right now what will happen with him haha. I don't see it being a MiL deal. We worked hard on that rule most big names will be FA like Yourelli Gurrelli was. You don't like current rule i wouldn't expect all would but no rule will please all so that is pointless to try really esp as it pertains to IFA. My league has used like 3 different rules never pleased all. Its pretty impossible to do.
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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Nov 17, 2017 15:31:08 GMT -6
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 15:36:44 GMT -6
I won't believe anything until its done I have a hard time believing he will sign a MiL deal b/c that means that team can send him down if they want and I don't think that is something he would allow to happen coming over 2-yrs early.
Regardless our rule is set-up where most big time international guys will be free agents more than not as has been the case.
Otani might have to be a guy with such an odd circumstance that we might have to discuss how to handle outside the normal rule we have.
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Post by Rangers GM (Pete) on Nov 17, 2017 19:46:16 GMT -6
whatever the rule is should apply, regardless of how good the player is. If our rule is minor league contracts get awarded to the team in this league, then it shouldn't change if Otani is signed under a minor league contract, it doesn't feel right to make exceptions just some of the time. As for the Braves losing some of their players because they cheated, that's a tough one, but I can't see undoing things from a year ago. I'd defer to the admins on that one, or maybe Hong can decide?
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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Nov 17, 2017 20:17:37 GMT -6
I agree. But the MLB is changing the IFA rules just for him as usually a guy has to be 25 and sign a MLB contract. They are restructuring the whole agreement with Japan to allow him to come over at all.
I just think we should examine the rule. Most years I think you could just even single out the top 5 guys for bidding.
Anyway, I know they are expecting him to sign in DEC/JAN so wanted to bring this up for discussion.
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 20:30:23 GMT -6
I agree. But the MLB is changing the IFA rules just for him as usually a guy has to be 25 and sign a MLB contract. They are restructuring the whole agreement with Japan to allow him to come over at all. I just think we should examine the rule. Most years I think you could just even single out the top 5 guys for bidding. Anyway, I know they are expecting him to sign in DEC/JAN so wanted to bring this up for discussion. I don't think rule needs changing a lot went into making it. Again no matter rule someone will complain about it. Just my .02 i am 1 person on a committee. If you want a guy bad enough you can trade for them and their cheap deals aka Yoan Moncada š and no one deals more than you Mort š
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Post by morf1980 (Rays GM) on Nov 17, 2017 21:05:25 GMT -6
Lol. I don't want to have to trade assets for a guy that by all rights should be on the open market.
Otani is a guy that would fetch a huge contract in our leagues open market. Probably the highest one this FA period. But instead he could potentially be signed to a rookie deal for 5 years just because of a teams name in our league. Nothing that owner has done to earn that at all. The rule as-is was NEVER designed to account for players signing MiLB deals and then playing in the MLB right away. This is something totally new-like I said, the MLB is changing its deal with Japan to even allow this. Previously players had to be 25 and sign MLB deals. So our rule was fine then.
In real life teams bid to fill roster holes in IFA just like in the draft. I just don't think it's fair to just hand potential all stars to teams. It definitely favors specific teams that tend to spend on IFAs in real life. And Tampa is actually a team that spends so it's not like I'm arguing for just me.
I don't get how "a lot went into a rule" that just says don't do anything and whoever signs him in real life gets him.
The MLB is evolving. They are changing their own rules so this is going to happen more going forward. It's a loophole. A guy signs a minor league deal with full intention of being called up immediately. I just think we should look at our rule to account for this important change to MLB rules.
Several proposals above are quality in my opinion.
But I do think we should hurry so the rule can be made official as-is or in a new form before we know who really will sign Otani or before any real solid rumors get started.
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Post by Rockies GM (Joey) on Nov 17, 2017 21:28:05 GMT -6
Lol. I don't want to have to trade assets for a guy that by all rights should be on the open market. Otani is a guy that would fetch a huge contract in our leagues open market. Probably the highest one this FA period. But instead he could potentially be signed to a rookie deal for 5 years just because of a teams name in our league. Nothing that owner has done to earn that at all. The rule as-is was NEVER designed to account for players signing MiLB deals and then playing in the MLB right away. This is something totally new-like I said, the MLB is changing its deal with Japan to even allow this. Previously players had to be 25 and sign MLB deals. So our rule was fine then. In real life teams bid to fill roster holes in IFA just like in the draft. I just don't think it's fair to just hand potential all stars to teams. It definitely favors specific teams that tend to spend on IFAs in real life. And Tampa is actually a team that spends so it's not like I'm arguing for just me. I don't get how "a lot went into a rule" that just says don't do anything and whoever signs him in real life gets him. The MLB is evolving. They are changing their own rules so this is going to happen more going forward. It's a loophole. A guy signs a minor league deal with full intention of being called up immediately. I just think we should look at our rule to account for this important change to MLB rules. Several proposals above are quality in my opinion. But I do think we should hurry so the rule can be made official as-is or in a new form before we know who really will sign Otani or before any real solid rumors get started. No offense but IF TB was in mix not sure your making this argument. We have a rule so not sure what your wanting ruled on exactly. I see no reason to change current rule. If ML changes we will look into but this is how they do it currently for most part outside of weird Otani stuff. If others disagree ok they can speak up so far it's mostly you.
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